I Don’t Accommodate Uncontrolled Men

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It’s summer! Time for all the the ladies to start posting articles about why it’s not a woman’s responsibility to prevent a man from lusting and all the gentlemen to start posting comments about why it’s not a woman’s responsibility, but she sure can help.

I’ve been encouraged to see the pushback, by women, even women in more conservative circles, against the toxic idea that a woman’s clothing choices can cause men to stumble.

But this pushback gets halted when a guy stands up and comfortably announces that while this personal responsibility thing all sounds great, the reality is that normal, healthy guys like him struggle, so women should still cover up. And the ladies go a little silent, unable to argue with this universal battle against sexual temptation that women never face.

The pushback against purity culture dies right then and there, because no woman wants to challenge the idea that men can’t actually control themselves — and that’s a beautiful, God-given part of being a man.

So I’m going to be that woman. I’m going to stand up and look that man in the eye and tell him that his inability to control himself is not normal, healthy, or God-given, and I have no sympathy for his struggles.

Because I don’t. I think more highly of men than that.

My husband didn’t grow up in purity culture. He didn’t grow up hearing that it’s normal and healthy for a guy to struggle with not looking until the offending woman leaves the room. He didn’t grow up hearing he couldn’t control his sexual urges if he caught a glimpse of a woman’s cleavage. He grew up around girls who wore bikinis to the beach and short shorts and tank tops. He grew up being able to look at a woman, notice parts of her body, even formulate a response (like “She’s attractive” or “She’s trying too hard”), and then go on with his conversation with her as if she’s more than her butt and abs.

He doesn’t experience this “all men’s daily battle” regarding women’s clothing choices, because he wasn’t socialized to.

And I think that is a huge thing people are overlooking in this discussion — how much of the “male struggle” can be chalked up not to healthy amounts of testosterone but to socialization?

Even as a female I was socialized to be uncomfortable with women in certain clothing — not because I was sexually attracted to them but because I was taught they were immodest. I would avert my eyes and feel embarrassed and not know how to talk to a woman with cleavage. Now that I’m socialized to be okay with women’s clothing choices, even if they don’t align with mine, I don’t find it awkward at all. They’re just people. They’re just bodies. No need to freak out or be awkward.

I think guys need to learn that it’s fine to notice a woman’s body and find it attractive. Bodies are beautiful. Beautiful bodies elicit responses in everyone. Notice it, and move on with your life. It’s not a sin. It’s not even necessarily sexual. This is how “visual” women deal with attractive men, and you don’t hear them begging guys to put their shirts on at the beach. It’s not socially acceptable for women’s sex drives to show.

I do find it disturbing and creepy and predatory that guys “struggle” so much around women who wear certain clothes. I find it disturbing that that’s normalized as healthy and natural. I don’t feel safe around men who can’t look at my body and engage with me as a human, regardless of what I’m wearing. I don’t feel comfortable around men who are battling not to lust after me.

And I don’t feel that I can control whether I “trigger” that battle or not by my clothing choices. How am I supposed to know what level of dress or undress is “comfortable” for any particular man? Guys will often say, “Oh, I’m not one of those guys who thinks women should dress like frumps. I’m not saying women shouldn’t wear pants or above the knee skirts or tank tops — I can handle those.”

But you know what? Some guys apparently can’t handle pants or above the knee skirts and tank tops. Some guys are more turned on by women in skirts. They’ve told me this to my face.

So what’s “normal”? Is it normal for a guy to struggle when he sees a woman in jeans, or only when she’s wearing a short skirt? Is it normal for a guy to struggle when she’s wearing a one-piece bathing suit and shorts, or only when she’s wearing a bikini? Is there an all-male council who has decided what’s “normal” for a guy to struggle with, and what’s creepy? Because I keep hearing mixed messages from men about what turns them on and what’s modest, and it makes me think the problem isn’t with what women wear but with what men can’t handle.

I think “normal” is a guy being able to interact with a woman comfortably, regardless of what she’s wearing, without waging a battle for his soul. Period. I will not accommodate any other male normal.

Moderator’s Note: This is stirring up a great conversation! In order to keep this a great conversation, I’m going to start deleting comments that make derogatory remarks or personal attacks against others who disagree. Be feisty but gracious!

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1,076 thoughts on “I Don’t Accommodate Uncontrolled Men

    • Stmike Catholic Q&A (@StmikeQA)

      Both women and men have a responsibility in this matter. We need to remember the teaching of St. John Chrysostom on modesty. Remember as you read this that the teaching the Saint is giving was 1600+ years ago (the 5th century). Nevertheless notice just how applicable it is today in the 21st Century. This is the best quote on the subject that I have seen.
      Quote:
      You carry your snare everywhere and spread your nets in all places. You allege that you never invited others to sin. You did not, indeed, by your words, but you have done so by your dress and your deportment and much more effectively than you could by your voice.

      When you have made another sin in his heart, how can you be innocent?

      Tell me, whom does this world condemn? Whom do judges in court punish? Those who drink poison or those who prepare it and administer the fatal potion? You have prepared the abominable cup, you have given the death-dealing drink, and you are more criminal than are those who poison the body; you murder not the body but the soul. And it is not to enemies you do this, nor are you urged on by any imaginary necessity, nor provoked by injury, but out of foolish vanity and pride.
      :End Quote

      Liked by 1 person

    • Reggie Franklin

      As a man, my primary side alone tells me as others have researched; women since to have learned to socialize and men at two have been kicking hurting and bitting to get their ideas or emotions out.

      With this in the forefront of thou mind Temptation runs under and over almost EVERY ASPECT OF A HUMANS LIFE (NO CLASS/TITLE LEFT OUT)

      Men since back in the day have gone to war to get/obtain their desires and others defend. Not the woman being there weaker version.. But men.
      Enticed by all that HE SEES! SO IF YOUR FLASHY WITH MATERIAL GAIN OR LOOKS A MAN WOULD WAGE WAR TO GET IT.

      How then so you keep that dna since way back when at Bay… By being modest, OR STRONG ENOUGH TO HANDLE WHAT YOU HAVE.

      Like

  1. jesusfreak155

    Good evening (It is evening here in Nigeria). The article is superb, but i just want to clarify something: Is the attitude here one of ‘I can dress however i want, so deal with your depraved mind’? If it is, then i think that it may not be the best. Paul speaks about this matter, but with something even more innocent: eating meat. I think the principle to apply here is that same. I am a guy, and will not presume to speak for women, but I would feel a lot better knowing my sisters in Christ were considerate of me while picking out their dresses. I have no issues with the women outside Christ, but I like to think that my sister are being as helpful as is reasonable in taking away the occasion to be tempted.

    Here is an illustration: For a while, I was privileged to teach regularly at a student’s fellowship where the congregation sat on overflows that rose up, such that the seats behind were the highest, and those in front, the lowest. The knees of the person behind you would bump your head occasionally if you were sitting down. It could be extremely distracting as a teacher to, while looking at the congregation, see a very short skirt because it would be from a debilitating perspective. Same for someone who innocently tries to look back during the service and encounters what is larger than him. Am i saying that it will necessarily descend to lust? No. But it is a temptation. My argument is to refrain, as much as is within our power, to not be an ‘occasion for sin’ or a ‘temptation’ to our brothers and sisters. if we know that sin is so damning, why take the risk with your brother?

    Liked by 2 people

    • Maliha Kinton

      I think the point in the article is proven by what you smjust said. I shouldn’t have to consider you or every other man on the planet that I may come in contact with each day when I pick out my outfit to ensure you’re comfortable. Do you consider us? Probably not because our society and culture doesn’t teach men they need to consider women when they dress. Maybe we aren’t as lustful or sexual or uncontrolled as them? What item of clothing has any man been told not to wear because it’s too distracting for a woman? (And don’t say skirts or dresses because in heteronormative culture, that seems to be a distraction for everyone unless you preface it with “my ancestors are scottish!” Plus, I’m talking about an item of clothing that should be just SO as to not distract anyone. Don’t wear too tight of a shirt, or pair of pants, too high of a shirt, too low of a neckline, etc. all things women are told and taught from be word go.)

      Lastly, anything is a distraction if you aren’t exposed to it enough. Think of people who are a part of nudist colonies. I’m sure they find the naked human body (male AND FEMALE) distraction when they first join that community, but as they grow a part of it and are exposed to it, they just see the lesson they’re speaking to who may or may not be in the buff. This goes for plenty of other cultures where nudity (partial or whole) is seen as acceptable.

      Anywho, long story short, I don’t accommodate uncontrolled men either.

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      • jesusfreak155

        Neither do I, accommodate uncontrolled men I mean. But, there is balance in life. No coin has only one face. Maybe our cultural differences are too large for us to communicate effectively on this subject?

        Like

    • Catherine

      Thank you brother in Christ ! I totally agree with you! This clarification should be added to the text so it doesn’t get somebody to interpret it wrongly ! May God bless you !

      Like

  2. Sarah

    I hear you… but I am sitting here Scratching my head. Society and socialization changes. Modesty certainly isn’t a new concept, neither is personal responsibility. What does God say about the subject in His Word? I see little of that in this post. If modesty is a commanded in the Bible how can we take that lightly. God doesn’t speak just to hear Himself. The laws and boundaries He gives are not vindictive in nature but rather protective. So, let’s talk about that. If God commands it…..then how are we to view that?

    Liked by 1 person

      • George

        Yes but we are fallen creatures. As Christians we must understand that concept. God calls us to respect our bodies because they are temples of the Holy Spirit. I am not saying wear a sack over. But there is a way to dress modestly but also beautifully.

        Liked by 1 person

      • Catherine

        According to TOB, it is the human body that most reveals the divine mystery of God. Thus it is the greatest sin to misuse the body and it’s beauty in a selfish way, but it is the greatest virtue to give it in selfless love. When Adam and Eve first looked at each other’s naked bodies, they did not struggle against lust. They saw the body as it was meant to be seen – a beautiful sign of God’s love. If only everyone did the same.

        Liked by 1 person

    • Kristen R. Rosser

      Actually, you know, the verses commonly used on the subject of modesty in the church, are actually about not showing off wealth (braided hair that could only be worn if you had servants to braid it, or gold and jewels) in front of your poorer brothers and sisters. Let’s face it, everybody back then wore robes, so the issue of cleavage and thighs didn’t really come up. So the Bible’s teaching about modesty is actually not a teaching about modesty as defined today. On that issue, other than telling the man not to look at a woman with INTENT to lust (that’s the meaning in the original Greek; it’s not just about feelings of attraction), the Bible is silent. In short, the responsibility for lust rests solely on the one doing the lusting.

      Liked by 3 people

    • Sam

      When God’s word refers to modesty, it is usually referring to modesty of heart and intention (not seeking to be seen and praised by people). The references to modest clothing are usually talking about not wearing expensive clothing (again to be noticed and praised). I’m sure if a woman is wearing revealing clothing because she wants to be noticed, that would also fall under the definition of immodesty, but modesty is a personal thing that begins in the heart and intentions of a person, and it should never be taught that men can’t control themselves when women don’t cover their “tempting” bodies. That is harmful to both women and men. The word of God teaches personal responsibility. It is our responsibility to look at our hearts and pray for change where it is needed.

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    • Maliha Kinton

      I don’t know much about the actual scripture in the Bible that speaks on this, but appreciate others responses on the matter. I just wanted to ask why everyone on the planet should adhere to some muddled dress code by a god they may not even believe in? Christianity is estimated to be the religion of 31.5% of the world’s population. Why should the other 69.5% adhere? This is like a conservative Muslim person thinking the entire world’s population of women should wear hijabs. How would you feel about being made to do so because someone else’s religion tells you it’s respectful of God and men? I, personally, wouldn’t like it, but then again, as a woman I don’t really like anyone telling me what to do or wear.

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      • carl

        You girls wear what you want, you will anyways..then you absolutely will reap what you sow also. By chance and luck hopefully you will learn by your choices not too harshly. If we all are lucky we will live to learn and grow old.

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      • Bailey Steger

        This thinking perpetuates rape culture and victim blaming, Carl. It’s absolutely not okay to tell victims to change something that has no bearing on their sexual harassment and assault when the real problem is predatory men.

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  3. gabriellerivas

    Read your post and I agree that we should all treat each other the same no matter what we are wearing because it’s our choice. I am curious to know what you think of people like Kim Kardashian or Amber Rose who post naked photos of themselves. I do believe women should have no problem with showing they their body but is there a line and if there is when is it crossed? I’m just curious of your opinion and maybe others.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Bailey Steger

      Honestly, I don’t have many thoughts on this since I don’t keep up with a lot of pop culture! It would depend on their motivation for posing naked. Do they feel pressured to present themselves sexually? Are they trying to promote body consciousness? Are they considering these photos art?

      Liked by 2 people

    • Randy Thio

      Not saying that women (like Kim or Amber) shouldn’t be showing their bodies, but the question I have is WHY? For what purpose are they showing their bodies? What is the intent? And if indeed being naked is who they truly are as a person, then why not just go naked everywhere?

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  4. mgdavisblog

    I’m a woman and I think men who whine about the male struggle never want to grow up and take responsibility for their self-control. On the other hand, a few years ago women didn’t show as much as they do now. In our present socialization, it seems the “fashion” is to show as much as one possibly can without getting arrested. Sometimes even I flinch from embarrassment for the girl who bends over in a skirt so short I fear what I’m going to see. My husband tells me he goes into places of business where women should dress professionally, and he has to avert his eyes while talking to the female because her boobs are about to jump out of her shirt. I think a lot of women out there want men to look at them and lust, and then complain about it.

    Liked by 2 people

    • Rachael

      What about women with big breasts? Everything I wear gives me cleavage, minus t-shirts and turtle necks. So please tell me again why women need to be more professional in the way they dress. Because big boobs make you have cleavage 24/7.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Maliha Kinton

        Actually, she probably is the average woman. In the USA, the average breast size is 34DD in 2013. It’s probably gotten bigger in the past four years. And women who have large breasts are generally told even more so that we are a distraction. (I say we as I myself am currently wearing a 36G bra) and if I step out of the house with any normal neckline that wouldn’t show cleavage if I was a B, I get gawked at like a sideshow freak. I shouldn’t have to wear a burlap sack or anything that has no shape to it to feel comfortable. Men should control themselves and their reactions. If I were to get angry and hit someone, I would get arrested for MY reaction because it is my responsibility to govern my own reactions. Why aren’t men held to the same standard when it comes to women and how they dress?

        Liked by 1 person

  5. thutchicady

    I really appreciate what you have said here! I am 5 ft tall and busty and I design and sew my own clothes. I keep things covered modestly. But being short if people walk up on me they will look right down my shirt. I found this hard to believe, from both sexes. And very frustrating, due to a turtleneck being the only total coverage. Thank you so much!!

    Liked by 1 person

  6. Joel

    “I don’t feel comfortable around men who are battling not to lust after me.” Wow. This coupled with “I don’t have any sympathy”, etc. The tone is so devoid of empathy and, it seems, an effort to understand the other side. It villifies (and actually, creepifies) even a man’s “private struggle”, a phrase which I’m sure you hate, though it’s hard to understand why. One could almost interpret this piece as “if a man is strongly attracted to a woman, he’s a creep.” Gah!

    “I’m going to stand up and look that man in the eye and tell him that his inability to control himself is not normal, healthy, or God-given, and I have no sympathy for his struggles.” That would be both callous and at least somewhat inaccurate, if all we’re talking about is a man’s struggle to not lust. (Not words or actions a la harassment.)

    We are always, always influenced by environment. If someone walks down a busy sidewalk naked, people will be distracted. The only question is where you draw the line. And I think people can be considerate and compassionate in thinking about where this line should be.*

    “Uncontrolled” men are those who *do* or *say* unacceptable things. Not those who face up to their lust (whether for someone in a tunic, or a bikini) and find themselves distracted. But you seem happy to shame them and throw them under the bus.

    *I do agree with that socialization hugely impacts how men view women, and I have wondered what the ideal society would look like on this question. My sense that “some clothing = good” may be very socialized and even wrong-headed. Maybe we should allow public nudity (this isn’t sarcasm). Or even just model some nonchalance for younger people when someone gorgeous and almost-naked walks by…

    I actually recall a remarkable article by Adbusters years ago – it was from a guy who observed that for six months, he had not wanted sex with anyone but his wife. I believe they had been living in a culture where women regularly go topless, and he found that without the added manipulation of ad-culture, his desires simplified and were more naturally focused on his life partner. I’m not sure what the answer is, but it was a very thought-provoking piece. And for the record, I have at times felt lots of lust for someone fully-clothed, and very little for someone in a bikini.

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    • Life In Stilettos

      There is no point in feeling sympathy for men who CHOOSE to view women solely as objects for their consumption; clearly, as you’ve stated, whatever they’re wearing. As you wrote, you’ve been attracted to full clothed women. So, I ask YOU where does it stop, then?? If you feel lust for a fully clothed woman, and if you should not be responsible for your thoughts and actions, what should women do to be sympathetic to your plight? Should we never leave the house, wear burkas…? Where does the slut shaming end if you are attracted to any woman wearing anything? You’re only, in fact, attempting to protect and empower your male privilege here, in suggesting a woman is being mean to you because she expects you to behave like an adult with self control, instead if some dumb drooling toddler. There’s no sympathy for men like you because you don’t need it. You need to grow the fuck up and claim responsibility for your own actions, regardless what ads you see or what a woman wears.

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  7. Morpheus

    Incoming male opinion alert!
    Totally agree with the article. It is a socialisation and education issue. I recognise in my own childhood a rather unhealthy education around girls and sexuality (but it was a long time ago when attitudes were different). But thankfully I have grown out of it.
    Thankfully, these days I can in fact appreciate the beauty of a shapely and overexposed woman and not feel the need to do anything more than smile. I realise that a woman is not defined by her looks but something my deeper and more permanent. It is that part of her I am more interested in interacting with. I never compliment a woman on her looks – only on her character and this I believe is especially important for young girls who grow up with the idea that their value is in their appearance. If that is not setting them up for a life of depression I don’t know what is.
    In the business world, there is a typical dress standard. Excessive cleavage for example in this environment may be largely inappropriate and detract from the business at hand.
    Beauty is a wonderful thing. But it can also be a distraction which can have negative and unintended consequences if presented in the wrong context. I recall going to one business meeting once where the convener requested men wear suits and ladies wear something which helps others to look them in the eyes – presumably because we were there to discuss business and not cleavage.
    But absolutely, men who struggle to control themselves in the presence of a beautiful woman (fully covered or otherwise) is a sign of a sick society which has failed to socialise and educate men appropriately.

    Liked by 1 person

  8. Shawn Meyer

    I think this article reflects a lot of immaturity and selfishness. I’m sad that a Christian woman would have this perspective. What Christian would say to someone, “I have no sympathy for your struggles” and pledge not to accommodate others who want to walk in obedience to Christ? There is nothing remotely biblical about this woman’s perspective; it is thoroughly worldly.

    Liked by 1 person

    • Aubrie

      I think the point here is saying “I have no sympathy for your own lack of control that is causing you to struggle. These men are not dealing with God-given struggles, they are dealing with a struggle that they have been told is not something that’s should take control of and that they are responsible for. The author is saying no. That they need to take control and responsibility for their own thoughts and actions and not blame their own thoughts on the woman they are looking at. It’s like saying, “I shot him because he made me angry.” I have no sympathy for that man who blames his own bad thoughts and actions on others.

      Liked by 2 people

      • Bailey Steger

        Yes, Aubrie, exactly!! Thank you for summing my thoughts up so succinctly. I have great compassion for a man struggling with a real problem that he owns up to FULLY without blaming others, but not for the man I described and Aubrie further described.

        Liked by 1 person

    • Jessica

      I think another way of saying it would be, “I can not take responsibility for your struggle, you need to do that!” She makes a valid point in this article that it is nearly impossible to accommodate and prevent the struggles of all men, and it is difficult to figure out where the line of acceptability lies. I went to a conservative university where a dress code was followed (no sleeveless shirts, shorts and skirts come close the knee, no skin tight clothes, etc…) and I still witnessed occasions of young men trying to shift blame for their own lustful thoughts and behaviors to young women for the way they were dressed. One famously derided editorial to the school newspaper complained about girls carrying their books in messenger style bags that cut across the body because the drew attention to the breasts. The problem was with a message to young men that they were not responsible for their own lustful thoughts.

      Liked by 3 people

  9. Jeff H. Ulrich

    Take the debate off the table about the morality of modesty. Being sensible about personal security should be a woman’s core concern. Someone here said, “dangerous men are out there.” More so than ever, this is true. I taught my daughter that she would be a fool who plays with fire if she is not mindful of how she dresses, where she is going, who she is with, and all other safety factors. When I travel to work at 7am on the trails and see the occasional female jogger running alone in an isolated wooded area, I must wonder what she thinks would happen if a predator targeted her. Martial arts and mace are not substitutes for using good common sense to keep from harm’s way in the first place. Women, do not be the bait, put yourself on the hook, and then expect your abilities — including one to win a debate here with rational minds — would mean much when you’re up against someone who is determined to use his strength and element of surprise to have you as his prey. You could certainly take measures to blend in and avoid the risk of being attacked and STILL be at a disadvantage in a bad situation but, please daughters, … be smart! You are too special to become a victim, and I almost literally get sick in my stomach when I hear on the news that one of you has been raped and killed. Be wise and secure to live another day.

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    • Lea

      ” Being sensible about personal security should be a woman’s core concern. ”

      You are not the first man to come in and try to ‘help’ by saying this.

      The problem is, safety has nothing to do with clothing. Watch where you’re going, situational awareness, self defense training, etc. All of that is part of every day risk management.

      If you are hoping for the length of your skirt to save you from a predator you will be in serious trouble. ‘Dress ‘modestly’ for safety’ is bad advice.

      Liked by 1 person

      • stephonix

        Also, that thought process puts SOLE responsibility on women not to get assaulted. “You are too special to become a victim” implies we have any control over how men think and react.

        The bottom line is…we don’t. Sure, I can make sure I am covered up, but I promise you, that in no way deters someone from assulting me. When you say “do not be the bait” and that logical argument wouldn’t deter someone intent on assault. To that I say, yes. Agreed. Logic does not deter. And if logic doesn’t, why would a longer skirt, or a frumpy sweatshirt, or no makeup?

        Can you imagine every morning when you’re deciding to put on clothes that you have to take into consideration the shirt you’re wearing could cause someone to assault you? Can you imagine trying to stay healthy and active, but not being able to workout alone for fear of assault? It gets overwhelming and frustrating and so so exhausting.

        It’s exhausting to know that if we get assaulted, we get blamed.

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    • Bethany

      You do know that most perpetrators of rape and sexual assault knew their victims and that the ‘stranger in the bushes’ idea isn’t often reality, right?

      There are lots of comments here from women who’ve been assaulted, catcalled etc while dressed perfectly modestly. I’ve personally never been catcalled (which most women will agree is an alarming thing) when dressed ‘immodestly’…but it’s happened several times when I’ve been wearing knee-length baggy cargo shorts, and once when I was wearing a suit for a job interview. Guess I just ‘baited the hook’ too much for those men to resist!

      You know what makes me sick to my stomach? Every news story I hear about women who’ve been battered or killed by their partner or ex-partner. Modest clothing and ‘common sense’ would have prevented almost exactly none of those crimes.

      As I wrote in a previous comment, most women ARE concerned about their personal safety. Every ‘risky’ choice that I make is weighed carefully: Is it worthwhile to go to the pool at night? Walk back alone to my car? Should I walk on the lighted side of the street, or not? Hood up so that my long hair can’t identify me as a woman? Or hood down so that I can hear a potential attacker coming?
      It’s very easy for a man to look at a woman’s choices and say ‘why weren’t you just more careful’. What you fail to see is the myriad of choices that she has made in her life that do revolve around protecting herself from men.

      Liked by 1 person

      • Jeff H. Ulrich

        I did not “fail to see” or not account for anything in my comment. And I well enough expressed a heartfelt care and concern for my fellow human being. I would be a failure as a human being to not draw upon my long experience in this life and then share my perspective that, by taking into account all factors stated between you and I, women are being (here is that word I used) “wise” when they apply that certain attire at the wrong places and at the wrong times increases their chances of becoming victims. I am not a woman, but I happen to be a man with the vulnerability of a certain handicap. And my handicap necessitates that I travel via means that regularly bring me into harm’s way. With years of trial and error (“error” meaning disaster), I learned very well that how I carry myself AND dress affects how well I blend in, and these measures collectively act as deterrents when stealth is not possible. I do not need statistics to know that, not just men but, women who would be assailants think twice when the sum of it all (including attire) represents to them less opportunity, value, and perhaps even more trouble than a criminal act is worth. I understand and respect a woman’s desire for a world where attire is not a factor for personal safety in certain places; I could relate as someone who has often wished that people would not underestimate other people because of apparent flaws. But I would not allow my desire for absolute social acceptance to override my sense to apply every measure where it makes sense to do so. And for the record, I am someone who totally gets and accepts the healthy need of a woman to feel good about how she looks and to hold her head high at all times (I want no less for my daughter); I have often prayed for a world where, at all times, we could all feel so good and accepted. Fortunately, we are not in a state of anarchy that would compel us, in most places, to cover up and hide in the shadows; my daughter and I are not looking forward to winter when we must again store away our shorts and T-shirts.

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      • Lea

        “And I well enough expressed a heartfelt care and concern for my fellow human being.”

        You can care and still be completely wrong, Jeff.

        “I would be a failure as a human being to not draw upon my long experience in this life and then share my perspective”

        None of which has been spent as a woman looking to protect herself, and seeing which situations were dangerous. Maybe you should listen to other people’s perspective as well! Dressing to disguise a handicap would be more analogous to dressing as a pretend boy than being modest. Your personal situation has nothing to do with modesty!

        Predators tend to go for easy targets. Make yourself a hard target by paying attention. Clothes make little difference or where they do it’s more about easy of removal than modesty, so long skirts are easy, tight pants are hard.

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    • Aubrie

      If I as a woman make all my decisions based on fear, it won’t be long till I do nothing at all and never leave my house. I am not out after 5 in the winter because it’s dark, I don’t go to any social activities because someone might show up I don’t know and roofie my drink, I can’t pump my own gas, I can’t grocery shop alone, I can’t date or walk my dog. Women should not have to live in fear. There is a difference between being smart and letting fear dictate your choices. I choose the first because otherwise, what am I living for?

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      • Jeff H. Ulrich

        I never suggested that someone be afraid. All that I urge one to do is to be wise. Fear actually impairs wisdom to the degree that foolishness is at hand. To not take precautions for the sake of taking pride in one’s fearlessness is in itself foolishness. Pride goes before a fall, and fools rush in where angels fear to tread.

        Like

    • Life In Stilettos

      We should be teaching men not to rape so we can teach women not to fear. It is victim blaming and rape culture to suggest a woman has ANY responsibility to prevent a person from attacking her. It is the fault of the perpetrator, alone. There is no other person who can control another’s thoughts and actions, and women should not be held to an impossible standard men are not. If we truly taught boys not to rape, we wouldn’t be having this conversation. Instead, people use a book written by a bunch if men- men who were victimizing women- to provide an excuse for the rape culture the book created and men now use to subjugate women.

      Like

  10. Shannon Morgan

    Hi! I just went on a rant on Facebook. I refence this blog post, and I completely agree with you. Im looking for scholars who study these issues that have scholarly articles we can use as a reference. Please take a moment to read my post. Thank you!

    Liked by 1 person

    • Justin

      Contempt might breed Contempt, but so does selfishness breed selfishness. Additionally, justifying immodesty by giving zero scriptural basis to you argument ironically breeds contempt for God and truth while enabling poor decisions.

      You’re heartless and cruel if you think you can dress indecently and think men should control themselves while knowing full well how you dress will elicit a response. There is no concern for you male equals. Just a clear reduction of how men operate which you blindly advocate. It’s like looking at the sun and think it would blind me, yet still looking at it.

      You’re a daft feminist.

      Like

  11. trlwnc

    ftnd.org

    The problem isn’t the person, it’s the education. This is why I don’t watch most television. It’s pornography glorified.

    Like

  12. Enoch

    I worked with juvenile sex offenders for several years. The home where I worked tried very hard to remove anything that could be considered sexual, which had an interesting effect. It made everything sexual. I was talking with one of the residents after he left the facility, and he told me that while he was there he had to masterbate every day. After he left, he had not needed to once. Statistically rapes are less common in nudest colonies, not because men there are not attracted to women, but because the woman’s body is no longer a sex object. Extreme modesty teaches that the body is an object to ogle.

    Liked by 1 person

  13. Nothing to see here

    Honest question: how do you feel about a man who engages with you as a full human being without any expression or even indication of discomfort but then masturbates to the thought of you at night?

    Like

  14. Andrew

    Hmmmm…may I suggest something else as this article has admittedly bothered me and has taken a very firm view without much Scripture to justify it…

    To Christian men, self-control is a fruit of the Spirit (Galatians 5:22) and avoiding sexual immorality is an outworking of the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit (1 Thessalonians 4:3-5). Christ commands that to even lust after a woman who is not our wife is to commit adultery and this adultery is first and foremost a sin against God, not the wife, and is why it applies even to unmarried men (Matthew 5: 27-28). So we must take every thought captive and make it obedient unto Christ (2 Corinthians 10:5) as single men, as dating or engaged men, and as married men.

    To Christian women, may I suggest something: if Christ glorified God (John 13:31) and we should live in Him (Colossians 2:6), be conform to His image (Romans 8:28), be ambassadors of Him (2 Corinthians 5:20), and be disciples of Him (Luke 9:23), then in all things we do we must first and foremost seek to glorify God (1 Corinthians 10:31). Translating that to this topic and this article in particular, my question is this: what is your motivation for wearing that outfit? What is your motivation for having your cleavage shown? Is it for men and women to cast eyes on you or is it to glorify God? Would you be showing off that cleavage if you would walk with Jesus down the street? Would you want Jesus to look at your cleavage and note how attractive you are (as this article indirectly seems to suggest is ok)? Or would you wear an outfit that glorified Him? I hope the answer is clear. Of course cleavage may be on the other end of the spectrum (though it is used in the subtitle of this article so I’m not out of line in using this to illustrate my point), but the principle is this: our clothing should seek to glorify God.

    We are all required to work out our salvation with fear and trembling (Philippians 2:12). So there is a duty on both of us and the outworking of it – in this case for sexual immorality – should be towards the edification of all believers.

    Like

    • Bailey Steger

      I think you’re making a false dichotomy between dressing attractively and glorifying God, and a false equivalency between appreciating attractiveness/experiencing attraction and lusting after a woman.

      Like

      • Andrew

        My apologies for my late reply. I only remembered this post now to see if anyone wrote back. I also want to apologise because some parts of my previous post were a bit rude to you.

        But no, i do not think it is a false dichotomy or a false equivalency.

        Christ is supposed to be Lord of all aspects of our lives and this includes our dress code. It seems by your definition, and I do not mean this in offense, but it seems to take the approach closer to the world’s definition of attractiveness rather than God’s.
        ………………
        “I also want the women to dress modestly, with decency and propriety, adorning themselves, not with elaborate hairstyles or gold or pearls or expensive clothes, but with good deeds, appropriate for women who profess to worship God.” (1 Timothy 2:9-10)

        “Therefore, I urge you, brothers and sisters, in view of God’s mercy, to offer your bodies as a living sacrifice, holy and pleasing to God—this is your true and proper worship. Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.” (Romans 12:1-2).
        …………………
        So with the man of God considering Romans 12, he must be transformed by the renewing of his mind to understand what God finds attractive in searching for a wife (which is in part found in Paul’s letter to Timothy). A woman with a Bible where you can see the pages are well-read should make a man of God’s heart melt. A woman who is serving God in some capacity should make a man of God’s heart melt. Christ says the first is more important (Luke 10:41-42). But together, it would be reasonable to expect that a woman who has this in her life will also be one who dresses modestly. This is what should define a woman of God. So if she is seeking a man of God, she should be focusing on what God finds beautiful because the Holy Spirit transforms the Christian man’s mind and orients it to what God finds beautiful. And surely he will find her beautiful because she is seeking out “his good, pleasing and perfect will.”

        So as ambassadors of Christ in this world (2 Corinthians 5:20), everything we do should seek to glorify Him. I am not perfect by any means, but I will hold to this standard because it is God’s and I pray that the Holy Spirit may sanctify me and bring me closer and closer to it. This should be on the heart of every believer.

        And truly, the same applies for men in their dress code, what they hope a woman of God would find attractive in a man, and how they should prepare themselves (being in Scripture and having a service heart to God).

        I have to say again but in more blunt terms, your mention of cleavage truly shocks me. Again, what would the motive be for exposing cleavage? I would hope as a Christian you would have an expectation that all men should aspire to be conform to Jesus’ image. I do and for this reason I have the expectation of myself and every other Christian man (single, dating, engaged or married) that none should lust after a woman other than his wife. Yes, this means I as an unmarried man cannot lust because I do not have a wife! And I can’t because Jesus didn’t and I want to be like Him. This has been a difficult path for me but after many years, I rejoice in the strength Christ has given me to take every thought captive and make it obedient unto Him.

        But by this reasoning, you as a Christian woman should also have the expectation that I act like Jesus. And to find it ok for me to look at your cleavage and note your attractiveness means you would find it ok if Jesus did this. Even the thought of such a hypothetical is mortifying and stomach churning.

        The bottom line is this: if glorifying God is not central to all aspects of your life, you have to ask the question is He truly the Lord of ALL your life? You have to ask the question “am I searching to be obedient to Christ’s command that I should love Him with ALL my heart, soul, mind and strength” (Mark 12:30) or am I searching to love Him with most of me?

        I am learning day by day how to make Him Lord in ALL my life and I will still be learning this in 30 years time and until I die. So again, I am not perfect by any means, but I will hold to this standard because it is God’s.

        And I am not noting your error out of judgement. I truly hope my words have not come across so. We are all in this together as we aim to look more like Jesus. And I hope that a brother or sister will reproof me if I am in error in aspects of my life or my doctrine (1 Timothy 4:16). But I am noting your error – and under God’s standard it is an error and is not a scripturally justified position – because your influence seems to extend quite far and because of this, you should be careful of not leading other women into error (James 3:1) because we will all stand at the judgment seat of Christ (2 Corinthians 5:10).

        It is likely I will not revisit this post, but you have my email from this post so if you’d like to continue this dialogue, you are more than welcome to email me.

        All I ask is please prayerfully consider your opinions on this and on future posts in relation to living out the Christian faith. If your view is not supported by Scripture, which is God-breathed (2 Timothy 3:16-17), then it is not supported by God. And this goes for all of us.

        Like

    • Life In Stilettos

      The. Bible. Was. Written. By. Men. Not God. Men. Men who had and have an interest in preserving the privilege they have as men. Therefore, any words of the Bible used as weapons against women, or anyone else are inherently empty, flaccid, meaningless. The Bible is only a weapon because you have weaponized it against women. Because you have chosen to believe words written by men are the truth, and you turn your back on true empathy and compassion for your fellow human being, boobs or not. The volume of scripture you can parrot back and claim relates to your poor impulse control is inconsequential. You’re using the Bible as a weapon.

      Like

  15. Barb

    The argument you make is towards the nature of men – you say he’s not as sexual as we let him be. Your evidence, one husband and a lot of conjecture. Men experience sexuality very different from you and you’ve only reached out to try to understand how that sexuality should be such that it is convenient for you, you haven’t begun to explore it in earnest.

    As one who experiences male sexuality, I can say you’re fairly off the mark as far as I’ve experienced. You think I wouldn’t like not to think about and evaluate every woman I see for sex? You think, nay hope, that somehow male sexuality has been socialized into them and you’re unwilling to explore any other ideas because it’s not convenient for you – I know it may be hard for you or anyone of my generation to fathom, but nature is not for our convenience and life isn’t fair. Nature has bread into many, but not all, men to want to have sex with as many women as possible and you’re not happy, so you seem to want to blame someone for this inconvenience and you’ve decided to throw it back at men. Almost like tantrum throwing, but you can’t change the fact that most men will interact with women comfortably… so they can ultimately have sex with them – nature proves you wrong.

    Like

  16. Anna

    Most of these comments miss the point. I don’t think the author is saying that women should deliberately dress in a provocative manner, nor is she saying that men are not sexual beings. She’s acknowledging the fact that it’s impossible (and unfair) to hold women to an arbitrary standard of modesty, which still may tempt some men, depending on their preferences.

    I’m no feminist, and would shrink from the term in the modern era. I grew up in a conservative Baptist church, and rebelled against the fact that girls in our youth group had to wear shirts over their (one-piece) bathing suits on trips, while the boys wore no shirts at all. Would it have hurt the boys to also be required to wear shirts? I can absolutely see a double standard, especially in (some) church teachings.

    That said, as an adult, I choose to dress modestly. It’s a partly matter of professionalism, as voluminous cleavage really has no place at work. It’s partly because I’d like to be taken seriously, and be recognized for my character, intelligence, or contribution to society. It’s partly because I don’t believe that dressing provocatively is honoring to God, and hurts my witness to others. And yes, it’s partly out of mindfulness of my brothers in Christ. They are responsible for their own thoughts, and 100% so for acting on them, and it’s not my obligation to tip-toe around any possible triggers of their lust. That said, neither is it biblical to use my body to deliberately entice a man that I am not married to.

    This shouldn’t be an us vs. them conversation, and a little respect and consideration for each other would go a long way.

    Like

  17. Mike Stearns

    I’m kind of chuckling here because I’m imagining a pool party where people are wearing… accentuating swimwear, and it leaves a bunch of guys walking around with hard-ons and ladies with perky bikinis while just casually talking it up.

    Around here, married couples tend to flirt around and tease each other unless there are kids around for a birthday party or a weekend neighborhood bash. I’m not saying they’re swinging too, but I’m not saying they’re not either (although there was a rumor a couple years ago about a few couples happening to have kids around the same time because they wanted to take advantage of getting pregnant at the same time before it showed). I’m just saying they’ll openly joke around about how attractive each other is, and be playful about how if they weren’t married, then they’d consider their options. Sometimes, they poke each other’s tummy and tush too if they’re feeling comfortable enough. I know the jacuzzi can get a little frisky at a couple of my neighbors’ houses too after the sun goes down.

    In any case, things kind of change after you’re married. The modesty a lot of people have before they’re married dissipates because they’re no longer worried about spoiling innocent minds by indulging them in sensations before they’ve developed an appreciation for the sublime. There’s also no worry about losing a boyfriend or girlfriend to someone passing by since you’re reassured by commitment…

    …although there are definitely some parents here who enjoy teasing the kids of other couples. I guess it reminds them of their youth, and they get a kick out of the reaction from someone who lacks experience.

    Liked by 1 person

  18. Steve

    Thanks for the post, I enjoyed it!

    I did not read everyone’s comment’s only a few. It seemed like many are forgetting how powerful the minds we were blessed with are.

    As a man, I know for a fact that there is nothing a Woman can take off that would garentee, I lust after her.

    I also know for a fact that there is nothing she can put on to prevent me from lusting after her if I choose to think of her in a sexual manner.

    Our minds are so powerful we can even choose to lust after an individual who is not even in our presence, we can dress or undress them as we please, and still find pleasure, such that we become dissociated with reality and prefer it over real interaction.

    It is false to teach a girl that she is responsible in any way for how a man or boy chooses to think of her.

    It is time to teach young men that they are 100% responsible for their thought, and are to be held fully responsible for their actions. So choose them wisely.

    Steve Silver

    Like

  19. AT

    If male gynocologists can manage to control themselves at work and act professionally, then it’s obviously not something that is impossible to do. If you are a manly, uncontrolled man then please stay out of the health professions.

    Like

  20. John

    Historically, the catholic religion is to blame for men having such archaic attitudes about women’s cleavage. This began with Pope Augustine who was a sexually pervert before he converted to Christianity. REFERENCE: ( http://www.christianitytoday.com/history/issues/issue-15/augustines-sex-life-change-from-profligate-to-celibate.html ) From my stand point, as a man, my first encounter with breasts was as a baby when my mother breast fed me. Her breasts nourished me and made me grow stronger. For myself, when I lay on my wife’s breasts I feel comfortable, safe and protected. Breasts are a reminders to me that I am loved. In talking to men about ‘boobs’ it seems the less a man feels loved, the more cleavage bothers him. Men having problems with women’s cleavage is on them.

    Like

  21. Andrea

    It is true that what you are exposed to often becomes your normal. Like it was mentioned in an earlier comment, if you were in a nudist colony, eventually seeing naked people wouldn’t even phase you. Although, men and women both have a social responsibility to treat each other with respect. Everyone will have a different tolerance to nudity and provocative clothing.
    It’s true that there is a type of man out there that is maybe “under-socialized” to the modern day and a womans right to wear whatever she wants. But women can’t expect the science behind the male psyche to remain at bay just so she can show off some skin. If a woman chooses to show off her body, she has to accept that men will look. Some men will ogle..some will fantasize…some may glance and move on. Very few men will carry on with life without at least a peek. So knowing this, choose wisely whether to show it off or keep it modest. But we can’t blame men for their animalistic nature of being attracted to the female form.

    Like

  22. Albert

    Nicely written. Bailey. I would like to move from the ‘religious’ discussion to a view of acceptability. Women are a wonderfully beautiful creation, some perhaps less so. Many variations exist in the scale of beauty both inner and outer. The way someone dresses is entirely their choice, given social acceptance on their choice.

    The way a person dresses is how they feel and want to be seen. Dress how you like as I find there is an attraction that is shared in what you wear and how you wear it, and who may be permitted to see it. Clothing can also elicit reaction in men AND a statement to other women.

    Personally I see beauty in many ways, some of them include presentation. Others include demeanor and intellect. All of these mixed into a unique package can be wonderful. There was a time I felt intimidated by the splendor of a female body, but more attractive is their intellect and how they treat others.

    Seeing a women walking down the street with a light cotton shirt, no bra, short shorts exposing her lower curves on her butt, and well shaped legs, exposed navel with a belly gem is clearly stimulating and memorable. But once engaged the lasting memory is what comes out of her mind and threw those red lips.

    Can I handle myself, yes I can. I am looking for a lady that knows how to do the same.

    Like

  23. Albert

    I only worry that a male might feel uncomfortable and act uptight around a woman who is not thoroughly dressed if he perceives that there is an excessive amount of pressure for him to do exactly the “right” thing, and, as a result, I worry that the woman will judge him for doing the wrong thing or being a bad person. He might unintentionally give off the air of negativity and unintentionally act disagreeably towards her in the process of perceiving that he “needs” to be on his best behavior. If a male is naturally shy, doesn’t have much experience interacting, and is obsessive-compulsive about his own “morality”, he might unintentionally give off the impression of being standoffish or condescending while thinking that he is trying to do the “right” thing. Of course, the analogous plight of women and what they “have” to do to be “adequate” to men and suit men’s preferences is even worse than what any male ever has to deaI with; I am not doubting that. I completely agree that it is nothing more than a male’s responsibility not to act errantly. In my opinion, males have a responsibility at all costs to hide from women the fact that they have to exert effort to avoid their own errant behavior, because women do not deserve to be bothered or have their feelings hurt by such purely male concerns. I am just saying that if, perchance, a woman notices that a man is trying awfully hard to do the “right” thing even though he tries to hide it, by gleaning from his non-verbal signals, then we males WOULD appreciate a certain amount of unspoken, or spoken, sympathy or understanding even though it is certainly NOT obligated. That is all I am saying. If he tells her to wear different clothes, on the other hand, I agree that he deserves not even a tiny bit of sympathy.

    Like

  24. Kim

    Amazing article! As a mother to young girls I make it a point to reread it every few months. As someone who grew up in purity culture allow me to share singe rules for dress that were taught in youth group and Bible camps:
    -your belly button must never be exposed. To test for modesty raise your hands all the way above your head, if the slightest amount of skin shows it is inappropriate.
    – never wear a two piece swimsuit. If you can’t find a one piece, wear a large t shirt over your immodest two piece (meanwhile boys are all shirtless at the pool/beach)
    -no spaghetti strap tank tops, straps must touch youe shoulder
    – and the most ridiculous, do not wear your purse strap across your chest in a war that it accentuates your breast.
    So i think the point in this article is so much different than is it ok for women to dress provocatively. Rules such as these put way to much emphasis on young girls and takes responsibility off the boys, as not following these rules would be causing our brothers to stumble. It’s such a toxic way to raise girls

    Like

  25. Joneen Wilson

    This was so refreshing! My brother and I grew up in that strange purity culture, but my brother is different. I think it is because he fill his head the media the objectifies women. While I disagree that with the author’s idea that we shouldn’t sympathize with men from the strange purity culture, I think think she has the right idea. This isn’t a culture we should continue to foster. We can gently push them to do better. But where are these men like her husband? Can they start joining the conversation already?

    Like

  26. Maria

    So, this may get deleted and I will admit that I have not had a chance to read all of the posts. But where does porn come into play? I am religious but totally am in awe of the human body and the gift that it is for both male and females. What an awesome tool we have to fine tune and enjoy. But, let’s be honest our culture has been very influenced by porn culture. Both the male and female. If a man can’t stop looking at my cleavage then I move on and let him go his way both of us knowing we do not suit each other. Let’s be honest though, there are plenty of women who show cleavage to attract the type of man I don’t want in my life and there are plenty of men who can easily move on without even looking twice. So, where does porn come in? Well, what is normal now and what isn’t? It is so confusing!! I think it goes way beyond just staring at cleavage and animalistic behavior these days. Things in the sexuality department have a societal green light for “do what you want when you want” and we buy into it and then expect people to treat us differently than what is being shown to them. Mind boggling really. So, for this convoluted and perhaps not very clear reason I choose to show my beauty and worth by remaining covered up in a very classy way so as to send my own message that I love my body and respect my body and expect you to as well. Totally recognize that this is very different for everyone and completely respect what you choose to do.

    Like

    • Bailey Steger

      That’s a great question! I’m not a fan of porn, because it ends up normalizing our desires to sexualize people we don’t know. I’d still say the responsibility is on the people who consume porn to handle its effects on their interactions with others, rather than the woman they’re sexualizing without her consent. It’s understandable that men (and women) are having problems sexualizing others when our society often condones sexualization via porn, but the responsibility is still squarely on the doing the nonconsenual sexualizing.

      Like

    • Tedd

      Before you extol the beauty of pornography, Youi need to do some research into how sex trafficking feeds it. You should also catch up on the latest research about how it is lessening people’s ability to relate to real human beings.

      It is destructive and the research is showing that more and more clearly.

      Like

      • Bailey Steger

        Nobody is extolling the beauty of pornography! She’s saying that women’s bodies are indeed beautiful, but porn has conditioned our society so that women’s bodies are automatically sexualized in every context.

        Like

  27. katherine sheard

    ..just happened upon this article while trying to research physiological reasons why men think their comments cannot be heard… This seems like a way of excluding a person whom comments are directed towards. To demonstrate they are not part of a peer group? Or are these men just rude and unchecked?

    Like

  28. abetterman21

    Love the post. It comes down to personal preferences? Throw in a little bit of nurture and there you have it. Perhaps helping them with a new perspective is a way to gradually change their views.

    Like

  29. Pi Rho

    Overall If you are dressed all SKIMPY-You KNOW there are perverts in plenty and you WILL hear something.
    Men-Women Interaction:
    Society has F’d up and placed men in the role of chasing around women like puppies to see if this one or that one will talk to them. Women are increasingly guilty of OVERRATING THEMSELVES. But by and large:WOMEN ARE THE CHOOSERS.
    Women are conditioned to use a very “narrow range of traits” for a guy to be desirable.
    A women’s WORST enemy is HERSELF and FELLOW WOMEN: Why??
    MEN-Unfortunately, all too often in matters of women, they tend to think from the southern part of the body instead of that vestibule above their necks and end up playing into the whims of women.
    Women’s Greatest Complain About Men: Well they want to just play adult paint ball with a whole bunch of us without commitment.
    WOMEN—Which GROUP of guys do you FALL FOR THE MOST?? The answer to this question brings to a head the crux of the problem!
    WOMEN: Are SUPPOSED to be the more sophisticated emotionally relative to men and their often undisciplined urges. In REALITY you WOMEN fall in DROVES for your own downfalls….later that manifest as heart break, and all manner of emotional trauma. Yet, as soon as you step into town, the most superficial charmer has you in a spell very fast….and many of you fall into that same trap……falling for the people who NEED YOU the LEAST..
    If a woman used DUE DILIGENCE and selected the partner from the “level of effort” applied, you will be in a MUCH LESS precarious position and the reasons are simple.
    A guy who has to WORK EXTREMELY hard to win you likely will apply GOOD EFFORT to keep you.
    The SUPERFICIAL CHARMERS, who many of you trip heads over heels towards, repetitively, are the SAME ones that DUMP YOU the QUICKEST. They apply little to no effort and you deliver yourselves to him, and he becomes very prolific at scoring, as many of you become experts at “counselling sessions” to recover from the last heartbreak event.
    Society has conditioned you with a perilously narrow scope of reference to choose men, that many potentially perfect partners fall short of, and your desire for those is LOW while your collective desires for superficial charm, creates an “Artificial Shortage” of men for you, while providing “EXCESS SUPPLY” to the guys that are masters of spinning you like guitar strings as they run from lady to lady.
    CHOOSE THE GUY WHO PUT IN GOOD EFFORT…the Heart Break will be much less!

    Like

  30. Jeff

    As a male who is typical, has attraction toward woman, works on my purity of mind and thought, I support you in your attitude and article. Thank you.
    Each of us has our own conscience, and you should dress and act according to your conscience and dress to what you feel is appropriate. Especially when working out.
    It’s up to me, if I need to remove myself from a situation I can’t seem to handle. (I probably can’t spend time shopping in Victoria Secret for example without experiencing lust).
    If you are going to church and wearing tight clothes and showing a bunch if cleavage intentionally you might try to identify why you are drawing that attention to yourself.

    Anyhow. BE strong.
    A dad of two amazing beautiful daughters.

    Like

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